|
|
|
|
|
Your thoughts on this...
everyones thoughts etc are welcome,lets get this board alive with thoughts,suggestions,topics etc.
just like non BDSM people are invited to post on the BDSM boards....
non GLBT people are invited and actually,urged to post here.
C is for choice
I'm sure we've all heard this: People that choose to be gay...
Or: Those that choose to lead a lifestyle of homosexuality...
People who think along those lines argue that everyone is heterosexual. It's depraved people that choose same sex acts.
I don't know about you, but when's the last time the whole world got together and did the same exact thing? We're not all white, we're not all male, we're not all tall, short, blonde, blue eyed, fat, skinny...seems to me that there's always more than one way to be.
Next, you hear, "Well, animals aren't gay! So people aren't, either?"
Do I look like I have anything in common with a squirrel? Anyway, there is homosexuality and bisexuality in the animal kingdom. Yes, that's right. Whether it's from personal attraction or population control, there are animals that are attracted to the same sex. Usually, the person who brought up that comment says, "Oh, well, we're not animals, we're more evolved than that." Yes, that's right, we're better than animals. Come on, let's wipe out another species, we're so much better than everything else.
I won't address the Bible, because Christianity is not the major religion in the world (actually, I think Islam is), nor the only religion in the world; the Bible can be used to interpret anything you like; technically, it doesn't mention lesbians (whoo-hoo, girls!); and I've talked with a few Catholic and ex-Catholic priests on this subject (because it fascinates me, and these are just about the only guys I can discuss this with who won't yell at me), and most of them agree that there is room for error both in the translation and interpretation of the bible. Besides, any of you that ate ham this Thanksgiving, are probably going to hell. And I love ham and make no apology for it.
It's not a mental illness. See what the American Psychological Association say about it. And did you know that an estimated 10% of the population is gay, lesbian or bisexual? And those are just the ones that are out? I know, statistics are sometimes no good. But you have to figure that there are a lot of people that haven't come out yet. A LOT. No one knows how many. Some people even say that one out of every four people is homosexual, bisexual, asexual or transgender--in other words, not straight.
Also, take this into account: How many people would choose to be hated and persecuted? How many people would choose to have to lose "friends", family, be asked to leave churches and social groups? To be honest, if someone waved the magic wand and asked if I would change my sexuality, at times I've thought I would--but I wouldn't. Just like I wouldn't change my color to make me more socially acceptable. It's a part of me. It's not a choice, or a fad with me. It's who I am. Take that away, and I'm not the same person you knew before.
article by K.Hayes
Live.
Love.
Laugh.
Sleep Later.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
pref·er·ence-
1 a : the act of preferring : the state of being preferred b : the power or opportunity of choosing
2 : one that is preferred
3 : the act, fact, or principle of giving advantages to some over others
4 : priority in the right to demand and receive satisfaction of an obligation
choice
1 a : to select freely and after consideration
2. to make a selection
2a. to have a preference for
Not everything is about choices. You can walk out your front door and be hit by a speeding car or truck and die. Sure, you chose to walk ouside, but you certainly didn't choose to have that vehicle to run you down.
You can't always choose who you fall in love with either. Sometimes love just happens even if your mind is saying "No way", your heart may be beating a cadence in your chest. So I don't really think choosing to be gay is a choice that comes easily, or that one morning you wake up and think to yourself, "Wow! I think I want to be gay!" It all falls to the decision of where your heart leads you.
I've known women who were strictly heterosexual by "choice", but after countless bad break-ups, or countless abusive boyfriends/husbands, sought solace with the same sex.
You wonder why more people don't "come out" with their sexual orientation be it homosexuality or bi-sexuality? Because of the stigmata that still surrounds either.
As for choice of whether to date someone who is fat/skinny/ethnic/blonde/brunette etc. I'd rather call it a preference than a choice. It's personal preference.
Some people would rather date the "model" type because they are more attracted to them. Others may PREFER to date that chunky guy/girl because that is what they find attractive. I've dated both ends of the spectrum. Both fat and thin, cute and not so cute, blond/blue black/brown. I guess you'd say there's my only real "preference" is hair/eye color.
As for "choice", you always have control over the choices that you make in life. If you are born into violence, the psychiatrists claim that you are prone to violence. That may be true because it's genetically coded into you. But you can CHOOSE not to become a violent person. There are ways to help a person control those urges. Same goes for sexual offenders, etc.
But, as you can see, preference and choice are close brothers in their definition. So I don't think that anyone person can pinpoint the difference between the tow and would be able to say,
"Ok, that's a choice, and that's a preference". I believe that distinction is left up to each individual.This message was edited by Haunted on 10-9-06 @ 3:50 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I believe it is a choice although I want to state very clearly that there is no inherent "right" or "wrong" in any of the three choices. Four, really, if you count abstinence.
Inherently, our lives are nothing but a very long series of choices. Something so minute as what shoes to wear today to incredibly important choices such as having children or adopting. I do not believe that the human genome is so constructed as to hardwire someone as "heterosexual", "homosexual" or "bisexual". Inevitably, over time, one strain would prove to be the strongest and the others would either be removed from the gene pool or severely curtailed as non-viable to the survival of the species as a whole.
Indeed, from a personal perspective, I chose to fall in love with a woman. It was by choice that I sought a wife instead of a husband. The unfortunate aspect of these types of discussions is that so very few people can step back from an emotive and personal viewpoint to look at the issue as a whole. The definition of "right" and "wrong" are societal values which are based upon the judgement of the members of that particular society as a whole.
In many ways, the "loud and proud" approach creates the very antithesis of what seems to be sought. As an individual, I no more enjoy Prince Prissypants' lisping, screeching and effeminate behavior shoved down my throat than I do some thick skulled Bible thumper interrupting my peaceful, agnostic Sunday morning. Ergo, in both instances, I am much less likely to be either receptive or welcoming of those particular viewpoints in life.
I think this further ties in to the "struggle" that many homosexuals and bisexuals feel they are engaged in for equal "civil rights". Often, I have either read, seen or heard it compared to efforts of Dr. Martin Luther King. Unfortunately, by arguing every single minute point, the entire message is lost amidst the noise of hard liners screaming at each other over a non-existant line. What is lacking isn't "civil" rights but basic "human" rights. Poke or be poked in whatever orifice you like with whatever object you like behind the sanctity of your own closed chamber doors. The makeout sessions in public? Not appropriate for any orientation.
Instead of slapping an ill-fitting and divisive label on someone, can we not, instead, focus on being human with grace and dignity?
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
i don't buy it Christopher. My gay friends knew they were gay long before they were old enough to have an interest in the opposite or any sex at all. *smile
of course, there are some who choose to seek out a partner of the same sex after having a traumatic experience but that's not the majority of homosexuals.
as for the marriage issue, why shouldn't they be allowed to legalize their relationship? they're paying the premiums on their insurance benefits, they're setting up a house and joint bank accounts, marriage is a choice and should be granted to anyone.
many heterosexual marriage partners do horrible things to each other but we turn the other cheek because that's marriage between a man and a woman.
let them get married, raise children, get divorced and have all the rights and privileges the rest of us take for granted. for once the US is very very wrong when the rest of the world is getting it right *shrugs and steps off the soap box
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
i don't buy it Christopher. My gay friends knew they were gay long before they were old enough to have an interest in the opposite or any sex at all.
I'd ask for conclusive proof instead of anecdotal evidence. It has nothing to do with my belief or disbelief but that's not data that is reliably reproducable.
as for the marriage issue, why shouldn't they be allowed to legalize their relationship?
I did not address marriage at all, merely stated my own choice in the matter. I believe pairing is a basic human right and orientation is immaterial in that pairing.
many heterosexual marriage partners do horrible things to each other but we turn the other cheek because that's marriage between a man and a woman.
We do? Here I thought that what people do to one another was addressed by the judicial system.
for once the US is very very wrong when the rest of the world is getting it right
That is an opinion, not a fact. As I said in my previous post, "right" and "wrong" are societally created values. Specifically the majority of the society that holds political power.
]Sig[
I don't play video games. I train in murder simulators.This message was edited by Christopher on 10-9-06 @ 6:00 PM
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
hmmmmm interesting and thought provoking question....
I am gay because it is who I am.....and C I love Ya but You cannot disprove that is or is not genetic so truly You cannot say either way...no one truly can it is a mystery....but I know it is natural and right for Me and it is a part of Me just as My skin color is...plain and simple...I cannot choose to be straight no more then a hetrosexual person can choose to be truly gay....not just curious but truly gay....I am no more attracted ot a man then I would be a dog.....and that is a very natural feeling for Me....the thought of sleeping with a guy would literally make Me feel nausea as if I was going to sleep with My father or brother....~+nods softly+~...
nor do I believe it is an "abnormality".......no more again then skin color...eye color....build.....does it really matter though....no.....it simply is who some people are no matter how they got that way....and that means they are just as human as every one else and deserve the same rights afforded others....
and as far as our justice system....well that is a laff in itself and an embarrassment.....
SW~bron
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
and C I love Ya but You cannot disprove that is or is not genetic so truly You cannot say either way...no one truly can
LadyWolf, that is an incorrect statement. If such a preference is genetic, medical research can certainly do a cross comparison across multiple DNA structure samples after weeding out gender, hair color, height, etcetera to look for both the commonly shared strands as well as the differing strands. That's the whole point behind genetic research. To discover what every strand in the whole genome is responsible for and to find ways to tweak it. I would only hope that such tweaks are benevolent, like weeding out cancer or heart disease.
Take a step back from your counterpoint and do not use the words "me", "my" "mine" or "I". Look at the matter logically for just a moment.
Looking back over time, it can be genetically proven that the human being has evolved to better deal with his environment. It is known that certain DNA branches died out as being not as fit to survive as others. Natural selection is, in fact, quite the bitch when it comes to determining what species lives or dies. Genetically speaking, it makes absolutely no sense to evolve a strain that is not self-replicating. Why, at the genetic level, would a species naturally chose to not procreate?
The only answer that seems readily apparent is over-population. If a migratory species (which, by the by, humans started off as) can not move to more plentiful resources and are stuck in the same locale, it makes sense that a declination of breeding rates would occur. However, humans don't have the problem of not being able to manufacture more of the resources they need to continue with their day to day existence.
So I posit that it is a choice. Yet one so deeply rooted and subconscious as to make it seem as if there was/is/shall be truly no other choice. Now what the incipient of that choice is should be, and is, a completely different matter.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
why fight about something that can't be helped does it really matter why people are who they are?? i say if there happy let em be...
people are gonne be straight...gay......bi...black...white...blonde...and blue eyed weather we like it or not so just accept it...
but anyway i found this
There is no real explanation as to why some is gay and others are not. Although there is no right or wrong answer to the question, two of the possible reasons suggested by researchers are.....
"We are born with our sexual orientation"
"Some people become gay because of some childhood experiences".
but remember there just a suggestion...The most important thing to remember is that being gay is not a disease to be ‘cured’ or ‘fixed’. It is just a part of the wide variety of human sexuality.This message was edited by *Moonie* on 10-11-06 @ 6:33 AM
crawl on me, sink into me
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Is Sexual Orientation a Choice?
No. Sexual Orientation emerges for most people before or in early adolescence and before any sexual experience. Some people report trying very hard over many years to change their sexual orientation from homosexual to heterosexual with no success. Psychologists do not consider sexual orientation to be a conscious choice that can be voluntarily changed.
Most heterosexuals recognize that their own sexual orientation is not the result of a decision or an ongoing daily effort. The same is true for gay people.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
sorry C...on this You and I will have to agree to disagree......You are not gay and therefore truly cannot speak with any real knowledge of it or it's begginings or lifestyle.......I would not choose to live a life that robs Me of the very same rights others are allowed...a lifestyle that is dangerous at times and full of hate and prejusdice......I can no more choose My sexualality then can a person choose the color of thier skin......or gender or hair color or the fact they are disabled......that's not to say some do not choose it.....but I do not....it is who I am.....who I was born as....
I am who I am and that C is not a choice...it is just as natural and right for Me as being a man and loving a woman is to you......if sexual oreientation were a choci then straight poeple could choose to be gay whenever they wanted....and you know after many years of talking with people.....My best friends being straight I know it is no more a choice for them then it is for Me.....I knew very young who I was.....knew without doubt.....and was scared to death of it...but I never doubted it or questioned it....
I respect Your intelligence Tiger..always ahve and yes I can look at it logically.....but in the end....I speak about it form personal experience because I am gay so I can understand the need and the feeling in a way You can not......so while I love hearing all You add in this aspect.....You truly are out of Your element as a straight person...just as I could never begin to speak about or try to explain heterosexual tendencies.......
~+leaves a hug for the Tiger and goes+~
|
|
|
|